Play and go rigged?

[The Reel Story]

3 minutes ago, Xxxxwildingxxxx said:

You work for provider I think so I wouldn'take  you opinion for granted and all providers are different,  they dont rigg directly but bit hot and cold is real and any slot player who knows slots can feel this to, some would not think about it some think its random, I speak for my self and I can tell at times when the slots cold especially with random features example Ted and king Kong cash, slots do have memory they know when you have done your achievements on immortal romance 

Ahh, the old 'You work for them so you want to protect the lie' line. It's a classic.

So, I USED to work in the industry. I haven't for over 4 years. And I was made redundant on pretty poor terms, so I have no reason to want to 'protect' the company or industry. Additionally, there are tens of thousands of people who work in the industry, over thousands of different companies in many different countries. You think ALL of them have somehow agreed to stick to this big wide conspiracy about how slots work? Especially disgruntled ex employees (of which there will be many). It's just not realistic. Like flat earthing, at some point you have to realise that the truth is actually far more simple than the lie.

So yeh, slots do not 'run hot or cold' as I said. The nature of random patterns do. Slots cannot be made to 'run hot or cold' (it would actually be very difficult to do and would throw up lots of issues with compliance reporting of RTP and accredited hashes of deployed software packages.). As I said, if you could tell when a slot is hot or cold, you would always win. This is part of the deep psychology of gambling. Veteran players think they understand the system, but their experience counts for absolutely nothing on slots.

As for tracjking achievements, yes, slots CAN have a memory. Anything can, and some have to track things, like lil devil with the hearts or whatever. But each spin is independent. I know you won't believe me, but it is ?

[Xxxxwildingxxxx]

Because the slots programme is fair and will do what it says on the tin 

[The Reel Story]

6 minutes ago, Xxxxwildingxxxx said:

Because the slots programme is fair and will do what it says on the tin 

Well, basically, yes, because it's independently tested and verified and then continually monitored.

Slots are already in the house favour. There is simply no need to do anything else. Operator and provider licenses are worth millions to them, why would they risk their entire business when they already make a lot of money totally legally? It just doesn't make any sense.

Now I'm not saying providers and casino's don't do dodgy stuff, they do, absolutely. But the stuff they do is either legal (just about) or it's the type of illegal that would just get someone fired, or a slap on the wrist, or a small fine. I.E, low risk stuff like taking casino managers out for coke and strippers to get your game promoted or evading tax through creative accounting or having horrible T&C's that they use to avoid paying big wins, because they know most people don't read the T&C. These are all things that happen, but are very low risk to the companies. Rigging, or even massaging slots, risks your ENTIRE business. It's just not worth it.

BTW, I do absolutely understand where you're coming from. I often get the same feeling. I had it yesterday when Pheonix Sun ripped my entire balance from me. Part of my brain was saying 'This slot will kill you, you need to go' whereas another part was saying 'Well it's GOT to pay soon, surely'. So it's human nature, I'm not immune to it. I just know that those parts of my brain aren't really talking sense ?

[dawka11000]

Yes mate feels the same, book of dead it's like book of dead spins for like a month now pays nothing, low stakes and about 400f pounds and maybe 2 bonuses. Fells like it's slot it's collecting money for big wins next month or whenever 

[dawka11000]

It's feels like this is true someone posted on first page

The latest statistics on 2+2 indicate that Play'n'Go does have a documented "Collect loses period" after someone hit a huge win. Which mean that the frequencies of larger wins are reduced down to an unknown number until they "can afford giving out huge wins". I don't think the streamers have an edge. They are just more visible than the anonymous crowd which also have huge winners ..

[dirtystack]

There was a guy who won the Rizk Book of Dead £1000 race and then the next day won the Rizk Rise of Merlin £1000 race. He got the exact same score in both of them after 500 spins.

Twilight Zone

 

[dirtystack]

Also to win it you have to gamble every win to a 10x win, so he had the exact same amount of wins that were either 10x to start with or gamble up to 10x, the only variable would be if he won three 10x in a row but that would alter his score and to get it back to even with the other one he would have to do that 10 times which, as it would equate to thirty 10x wins would account for 67% of his score. Possible I guess.

The moral of this story is that I should really get a life.

[CGDL]

Can you please, please read up on: 

• RNG (Hardware: Random Number Generator)
• PRGN (Software Random Number Generator)
• Independent certifications
• Critical code, RNG and game logic baselining
• Die -hard tests
• Chi-square tests

Go through the documentation of iTech Labs as an example of how slots are certified. 

Once everyone has read that, you can come back to this thread instead of discussing the results of non-bit level sample sizes. If you're still not convinced, I can sell you self-made tinfoil hats made from the finest aluminium at a heavily discounted rate. 

[dirtystack]

7 hours ago, chiefemptybottle said:

Another example is, that MrGreen never put public race-lists online. You actually don't know what place you get. I wrote them 10-15 times last year without any progress. Those lists are still not available for the players to see. Every time they answered that question they kept going back to "What was the question again?". I filed a complaint to the gaming authorities without any luck.  So, those authorities doesn't do much to protect the players. Purpose for them is to have an expensive address, drink coffee and eat expensive cupcakes.

Yeah, I have encountered this a lot as I seek out such promotions.

I don't play any promotion which cites "your position on the Leaderboard" and then doesn't actually show the Leaderboard publicly.

You could win and the casino could say you came third and you would have no way of proving anything. Not saying this is absolutely what they do, just saying the lack of transparency causes discomfort.

WHG show their leaderboards throughout the term of their promotions but don't publish the final leaderboard.  Their promotions are nowhere near as good as last year so I don't care too much.

Rizk, Guts - absolute transparency with their leaderboards - show them throughout promotions, though the scores reflect what they were the day before, and they publish a final leaderboard.

Unibet has live Leaderboards and they Update every few seconds - The best really, despite people exploiting certain promotions.

 

Edited 1 November, 2019 by dirtystack

[Xxxxwildingxxxx]

On 01/11/2019 at 10:07, CGDL said:

Can you please, please read up on: 

• RNG (Hardware: Random Number Generator)
• PRGN (Software Random Number Generator)
• Independent certifications
• Critical code, RNG and game logic baselining
• Die -hard tests
• Chi-square tests

Go through the documentation of iTech Labs as an example of how slots are certified. 

Once everyone has read that, you can come back to this thread instead of discussing the results of non-bit level sample sizes. If you're still not convinced, I can sell you self-made tinfoil hats made from the finest aluminium at a heavily discounted rate. 

Run them test when you think it's cold and compare when you think it's hot, it shouldn't matter right because of no memory, let me guarantee a difference 

[Xxxxwildingxxxx]

Yall need to take that tin foil hat off blocking  

Not off topic just to add !

[Xxxxwildingxxxx]

I think slots fairly programmed and an end result of millions of spins would end up fair so hot and cold doesn't really make a difference. Any way I could be wrong it's just opinion I have and I'll do what that guy said read up on it and at least I'll get some education on how it works and then I could well have a better view about it. Just seems hot and cold at times one theory I believe  the randomness is part of that cold patch which still is random hence hot patch to. But know one is ever sure when to stay on a game or to leave! My opinion it's fair yes I come to that conclusion but random patch of cold and hot games is there, when they should re program for it to be random per spin! But I dunno, 

[Plani Bardh]

On 02/04/2019 at 21:30, Slotspinner said:

you also sell nuclear bombs in your backyard, prove me wrong!

That coming from German guy   joking  ❤️  

[slotsofun]

Simple answer is....Yes, all slots are rigged. It's the wole reason why they have an RTP of less than 100%.

[The Reel Story]

10 minutes ago, slotsofun said:

Simple answer is....Yes, all slots are rigged. It's the wole reason why they have an RTP of less than 100%.

Mathamatically weighted in the casinos favour and rigged are not the same thing. 

[slotsofun]

1 minute ago, The Reel Story said:

Mathamatically weighted in the casinos favour and rigged are not the same thing. 

Well, to me they are the same thing, if something is set up to benefit another it has been rigged. Regardless if it is mathematically or not. 

[The Reel Story]

Sure, it's semantics. Rigged implies that the software is actively working against you. Keeping an eye on what you do and making sure you don't win by giving you specific results. Which, of course, isn't the case, so I just prefer that term isn't used as it spreads confusion. 

Certainly though, the odds are against you. 

 

[apudekikker]

Play'N'Go is confirmed rigged, casinos can lower the RTP on their games and they go into 'collect mode' after paying out a big win, NEVER play their scam games.

[The Reel Story]

18 minutes ago, apudekikker said:

Play'N'Go is confirmed rigged, casinos can lower the RTP on their games and they go into 'collect mode' after paying out a big win, NEVER play their scam games.

*sigh*. 

No they're not. If they were 'confirmed' rigged they wouldn't be available anymore and play n go would be out of business. 

They do not go 'in to collect mode'. No games in a regulated market do. They don't need to and it's illegal to do so. 

Casinos cannot change the rtp on the games. Play n go offer multiple rtp versions of their games and the casino can choose the one they put live. Once it is live, they would have to go through some regulatory hoops to change it to a different version, and the rtp would still be displayed in the help file at the correct value. 

[Guest Oriane]

On 07/02/2019 at 21:05, Nicola said:

Play'n GO are completely fine, you were just unlucky in your game play.

It's also worth pointing out, that some casinos have a considerably lower RTP on Play'n GO slots as the operator can set the levels themselves. Always check the RTP percentage in the help menu and compare with other reputable casinos.

What if u can not see the rtp of the slot and when u ask in live chat for they dont want to tell you that either ?cos this is my experience with cresus casino and lucky8 casino too.as im located in france that only casinos with few descent providers so i have to relay on them.but pay out here are also really bad had no descent win yet onany this sites and trust me i do shit loads of spins on each slots especially playngo and to get a bonus is a hard work and to get a bonus that pay like 100x  is like for mostof the players hitting 5000x

[dirtystack]

I feel playngo is rigged. 

Mind you I lost £8000 at 90% £2 bets, the rest £5, in a week - 5 or 6 Gargas 200x was the highest, the next highest was around 80x

There is a conflict between my head, with its thoughts, and my gut, with its feels.

Usually my head gets me in trouble whereas if I had just listened to my gut I would have avoided a lot of hassle - I will will avoid playngo as best I can.

[OnAirJannick]

I was incredible unlucky on Moon princess these days as well... would never say anything is rigged but on play n' go it feels like there are times where games like Rise of Merlin, BoD, Garga etc are just dead. I should just stick to Blackjack, slots are just not good to me ?

[dirtystack]

When I’m in tin hat mode and feel like they are dead, i’ll Look everywhere for streamer wins and forum posts of big wins in the same timeframe - when they are cold, they are cold for everyone.

They were dead for a couple weeks.

Confirmation of confirmation bias.

Edited 15 December, 2019 by dirtystack

[dirtystack]

37 minutes ago, chiefemptybottle said:

Actually they do, there's one famous comment to data on 2+2: If its random, how come scatters always make it below the line, or just above in a "tease" setup? - How come premiums suddenly stop appearing in a bonus when hit? - How come when you play 3 or 1 line in a 10 (or more) line game the big wins hit on a non paying line? etc etc - So, they do ACTIVELY work against you. A majority of the casinos "lie" about the real RTP (e.g Leovegas) who write BOD to 96.xx but actually are the lowest possible on PnG 92.xx. (The Casino's can decide this themselves on Play'n'Go machines, but with a fixed minimum).

I dont even think you understand what semantics mean? You can't use the term in a casino debate. The term are used a lot in hyped intellectual conversations, but people docent seem to know what it actually mean. Rigged is the word to use, since casino's are "deliberately" fixed. There's no such thing as "random" since the generated "random number" go through filters that destroy the random in itself totally.

You are saying things like its fact when you are at best exaggerating and at worst, lying.

You say they "Always make it below or just above in a "tease" setup" 

They don't "always" do that, there are plenty of times you hit 2 scatters without another in sight.

You say the majority of casinos lie about the RTP but you have no evidence of this, you cite one casino without proof and expand that implicate that majority.

Everything you are saying is baseless, much like the comments I made but at least I acknowledge they are coming from feelings rather then any knowledge.

I'm all for investigating, calculating and finding out if something is wrong but jumping in with something objectively wrong, stating that something always happens when it doesn't always happen, causes whatever you you then go on to say be written off.

Think about it, you are saying there is a Random number generated - all well and good, so we have a random number, you are then saying filters are applied to that random number and the randomness is destroyed - how can a random number can be filtered down to a non random number? Senseless.

 

Also please provide a link to the 2+2 thread so I can see the famous comment. I cant seem to find it.

The Stones cheating scandal is pretty interesting though.

Edited 15 December, 2019 by dirtystack

[dirtystack]

18 minutes ago, chiefemptybottle said:

Exactly my point, you trust what they claim, I trust the numbers.

I never said I trust them, I'm just pointing out that I don't trust some random guy that starts his argument with a lie then goes on to quote numbers - which he provides no source of, and a 2+2 thread that possibly doesn't exist.

Link the thread you are gleaning all this information from.

Also, don't try to imply that you know my mind and make out you know how I feel and what I think.

Trying to imply that my lack of belief in your reasoning ability somehow validates your argument and puts me in opposition to the consumer,  and on the side of the producer, jeez, flat earth much?

Edited 15 December, 2019 by dirtystack